Breadsall Station

Re: Breadsall Station

Postby WeaselWorks » Fri May 08, 2015 9:12 am

The downside of this is that it putts me off making buildings - because I'll never get that level of excellence...
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby Rockdoc2174 » Fri May 08, 2015 10:55 am

Brian always gives credit to the people who helped him develop the skills he uses. I'm certain he'll be as generous if you approach him. The more people there are producing high-quality assets the better for the future of the sim.

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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby AndiS » Sat May 09, 2015 8:51 am

You are looking at top stuff here, not average or entry level.

I watched Paul, Brian and a few others discuss station colours for years.

In my view (and minimal experience), there are these ingredients:
  • A good idea of what the colours should be. Takes lots of research and/or a few good photos that happen to show the image just the way you want it, so you can steal colour right from the photo.
  • A good set of textures for the, err, texture. Like bricks, stonework, wood. There are many sites offering more or less developed raw material. Building your library on these defines the building blocks you can use.
  • Either a 3D box with a roof plus lots of work and artistic compromise in a 2D paint programme, or getting the hang of extrusion and subdivision in a 3D programme and doing a little less in 2D.
  • An idea on how to get ambient occlusion, i.e., those shadows under the roof. You can bake them in Blender or paint them on the texture. I guess that in terms learning curve and final result, painting them yourself (using some gradient brush or whatever it is called in your programme) might beat the half clever, half automatic stuff in Blender etc.
  • Minimal messing with shaders unless you need see-through glass which may be a little harder to set up. But there may well be tutorials on that that I missed.
It is exactly as in cooking. You need to fight down the challenge of getting pasta al dente, rice of the right consistency, etc., i.e., you master a dozen functions in your 3D programme. In parallel, you collect an ever growing of ingredients, i.e., textures that look exactly like you want them to. And a few shelf loads of cook books, i.e., tutorials and hints from forums, plus prototype information.

Whatever you achieve stays with you until you forget it. The building we see here is exactly what the heralded Unreal Engine is made for. So you are looking at the standard for years to come. And buildings are easier to do than engines, because of the simpler shapes.
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby WeaselWorks » Sat May 09, 2015 10:47 pm

Oh, I totally agree. My comment was more 'tongue in cheek' Han anything else.

Part of the reason I'm moving very slowly on my own releases is because I want to get things finished to this level. And that's taking time... Brian's work is inspirational.
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby briyeo » Sun May 10, 2015 10:02 am

Although I am enjoying the great response to my building models, I have to say my models are not technically very good. There are lots of mistakes and errors that wouldn't do at all in a model of a locomotive or rolling stock. With buildings though, I can get away with it, just drive past them and don't stop to look too closely. ;)
Keith put it very well one time when he said " For someone who doesn't know what he is doing, you make some nice looking models", or words to that effect. :)

This model has been placed in the game now.

Image

I am quite pleased with my bucket though.

Image
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby WeaselWorks » Sun May 10, 2015 11:15 am

That is a magnificent bucket.
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby Rockdoc2174 » Sun May 10, 2015 12:11 pm

I don't know about the technicalities, Brian, but the appearance you manage to produce fully deserves the praise you receive every time you reveal another of your assets.

I'm becoming spoiled by working closely with you, though. Driving even recently-released routes I find myself frequently amazed/disappointed/surprised (delete as appropriate!) at the low quality of line-side buildings. Too many, IMO, have 2D faces visible to the player. What is adequate 100 yards from the line is not when it's 10 yards or less. What you can get away with visually at 70mph you can't get away with at 30mph and that's all the more true when you're at a standstill for several minutes at a station or signal stop. Yes, there are severe restrictions on realism in the sim unless you create your own assets and lofts and I'm becoming ever more aware of this as I try to populate the landscape around Breadsall. For example, there's a nice WH loft for a neatly-trimmed field-hedge but it's 2D and has a negligible width so it sticks out like a sore thumb next to the line but there is nothing along the same lines in 3D, even as a block, so I've used it. Another loft is a well-modelled three-bar wooden fence that's absolutely typical of railway boundaries but the creator forgot that the horizontals have to lengthen and shorten where the ground isn't flat. You can finish a run with a vertical post and the three bars floating in mid air!

Yet it may not matter very much. I am now much more aware of scenery and assets than I ever used to be and can spot the short-cuts even the best route providers have taken but, before I started playing in the World Editor, I used to drive past them and wasn't distracted. I suspect I must learn the lesson of proportion, knowing when I can do no more and stop fretting about what isn't necessary.

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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby WeaselWorks » Tue May 12, 2015 7:11 am

I'll see your bucket and raise you a 2 gallon petrol can.

4184

There is supposed to be lettering stamped on the top and on the screw cap, but that's a step too far for me. (For now.) And in any case, you can barely even see the can in game, let alone read the cap. The can is 14 inches high, 8 inches wide and 11 inches deep.

It's really surprising how hard it is to make a basic object look right, let alone a building. I got the basic shape down last night in about 30 mins (as well as a 4 Gal version) bu the detail has absorbed a few hours today.
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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby Rockdoc2174 » Tue May 12, 2015 8:39 am

You've done a fine job with that. You can tell it's been used and abused a few times in its life!

There was impressed lettering and logos on the sides of some WW1 cans like that. Just for interest's sake, I have a photo of the orderly room at 99th Anti Aircraft Section near Salonika (modern Thessaloniki) - where my Grandfather was the Serjeant on the No 2 Gun - whose walls were clad with unsoldered Shell petrol tins. Click on the thumbnails to see larger versions:

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Re: Breadsall Station

Postby WeaselWorks » Tue May 12, 2015 9:43 am

Oddly enough, this was modelled on a WW1 can... so I'm glad you recognised it.

:P

The 'flimsy' petrol can was in common use right through WW2 - which was a real problem unless you happened to be using it in a depot, because the thin sides were easily punctured. In 1942 it was estimated that nearly 20% of POL was being lost en route from the supply depot to the end user.

(I moonlight at the Australian War Memorial.)
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